On this “holiday,” that’s grown in meaning and popularity thanks to the promise of a bajillion new movies, I thought I’d riff on STAR WARS.

Like many in my generation, my first exposure to STAR WARS came with the re-releases in the 1990’s, preparing the world for EPISODE ONE. After watching and loving and being enthralled with the original trilogy…I launched myself into the Expanded Universe, devouring Rogue Squadron, Young Jedi Knights, the Jedi Academy trilogy, The Bounty Hunter and Timothy Zahn’s brilliant Thrawn trilogy. I think my addiction ended sometime during the New Jedi Order series, though not because I didn’t like it. I just moved on to different universes, and different book series, as STAR WARS not only made me love movies, but the Expanded Universe is what really got me into reading. And for that, I’ll be eternally grateful.

STAR WARS was one of the first things I was truly nerdy about, as I found room for Yoda and Han Solo alongside Shawn Kemp and Jay Buhner as idols, fitting in STAR WARS books with baseball and basketball practice. My first little league team name was Jedi Knights. Needless to say, we weren’t very good. I remember during the first All-Stars practice in 8th grade, my rival SS who was entirely too likable told the squad STAR WARS was his favorite movie (I’m not sure if he meant the first one, the franchise as a whole, or if he did say a specific episode). I said AMERICAN PIE to get laughs and garner popularity. I was a douche, and a liar, because I remember thinking to myself that Tim took my favorite movie.

I remember watching EPISODE ONE at the recently renovated Cinerama in Seattle, back when a visit to Seattle was a rare and exciting treat, for my friend Jacob’s birthday. Afterwards, I was excited about Senator Palpatine and seeing his transformation into Emperor Palpatine. For whatever reason, Jacob shot me down, calling me an idiot for thinking that would happen. It’s one of the more angry, perplexing, yet absolutely fortified memories of my life. What was he talking about? I honestly didn’t hate the movie when I first saw it. It wasn’t until I became older, smarter (not really) and more cynical, that I grew to loathe the Phantom Menace and everything it represented, though I’ll admit to deriving some satisfaction and joy from the rest of the trilogy. But it obviously wasn’t the same, not even close, and I think we all breathed a sigh of relief when it was over.

Now…it’s back, with Disney, Kathleen Kennedy and J.J. Abrams around to bring it into fruition. And…

I have no idea what to expect with EPISODE VII. I’m a huge J.J. Abrams fan, as LOST and ALIAS forever transformed the way I watched TV, and the kind of shows I watched. For my money, the first STAR TREK is one of the best blockbusters of all-time. But is the right person for STAR WARS? Is there a right person for STAR WARS? It rubs me (and everyone) the wrong way that they’re ignoring the EU, since the Thrawn trilogy just makes too much sense as inspiration for these three films.

While I’m as disappointed as anyone by the lack of ethnic and gender diversity with the announced cast, I expect the final ensemble to better reflect a more balanced galaxy far, far away (it better). Bring on Lupita. But I was impressed with all the young talent Abrams has cobbled together. I don’t know Daisy Ridley, but she looks the part of a Solo/Organa daughter, and certainly got my attention with this short film:

Adam Driver has one of the more enigmatic, unique and interesting screen presences on TV. GIRLS has all kinds of problems…but his character is fascinating, thanks to his performance. I wasn’t a fan of INSIDE LLEWYN DAVIS, but Oscar Isaac is going to win one of the very awards he may as well have been named after someday (unless STAR WARS ruins his career). John Boyega was terrific in ATTACK THE BLOCK, and is an awesome choice to headline the cast. And Domhnall Gleeson may be the guy I like the most of all of the young guns, since he’s just so charming and likable and funny. And then we get to Max von Sydow?! Andy Serkis?! Are you kidding me. Fucking sweet.

I can’t help but be caught up in it all, and speculate over what characters they’ll play, whether they’re Sith, Jedi, evil, good, both, alien, human, etc., while choosing to hope the original heroes are mostly background, supporting players there to help shepherd a new generation.

STAR WARS remains a part of me…and even if these future films blow…it always will. People love to complain about George Lucas, and what’s become of the STAR WARS universe since the original trilogy, but to me, it still doesn’t take away or tarnish my childhood. I will always love Chewy, I’ll always fantasize about Princess Leia and being a Jedi, and I’ll always want to be Harrison Ford. Well, that Harrison Ford.

And that’s what I choose to think about on May 4th (and not the below image). May the 4th be with you all.

At this point during SEVEN INCHES OF YOUR TIME’s brief tenure as a staple for nothing, director Don Bluth, along with owls and Edward James Olmos, have practically become the idols to whom we worship.

Don Bluth burst onto the directorial scene with THE SECRET OF NIMH in 1982, intent on combining owls and terror for the next 20 years of his film career. His resume includes AN AMERICAN TAIL, ALL DOGS GO TO HEAVEN, ROCK-A-DOODLE, THUMBELINA, ANASTASIA and TITAN A.E. (which I recommend watching whilst gorging on pot brownies). But one movie looms over the rest of them…thanks to a litany of longneck’s.

That would be LAND BEFORE TIME (1988), a childhood classic that is now known as what kicked off a franchise that overstayed its welcome thanks to its 43 sequels. It’s easy to forget how important, sad and poignant a film the first one was, and considering Don Bluth’s track record, it’s hard to discount his part in creating a movie that will make you laugh, cry, shriek and learn the benefits of racism.

Don Bluth had some help behind the scenes, as LAND BEFORE TIME had more muscle behind it than any other movie that’s ever been made. The powerhouse of producers includes arguably the most powerful couple in Hollywood, Kathleen Kennedy and Frank Marshall, who acted as co-executive producers, along with George Lucas and Steven Spielberg, who also produced the project. You thought INDIANA JONES was George and Steve’s best collaboration, but you were wrong.

LAND BEFORE TIME is only 69 minutes long, but it packs more emotional wallop than an entire season of REBA. Commissioner Gordon (Pat Hingle) is our host for the movie’s entirety, narrating the tale of five baby dinosaurs forced to grow up without parents mere minutes after being born, while facing the terrors of prehistoric times. There’s Littlefoot (Gabriel Damon), a Brontosaurus who watches his mother get murdered by a Sharptooth (T-Rex). Cera (Candace Hutson) is a headstrong triceratops separated from her father, Daddy Topps (the greatest Daddy character name this side of Daddy Warbucks), and won’t let you forget it. There’s the wise Rooter (also voiced by MVP Pat Hingle), who has giant Circus Peanuts for eyebrows:

Then there’s breakout (tree)star Ducky, who you either find to be the cutest dinosaur you’ve ever seen, or want to flush down the toilet.

Your heartless if it’s the latter, but I’d forgive you if you find Petrie, the hyper-sensitive, scaredy cat pterodactyl Petrie, annoying. I prefer Robin Williams’ Batty Koda myself.

Lastly there’s Spike, who’s basically an even more mute Eeyore. Together, the five orphans must travel to the Great Valley in hopes of finding more of their kind, and learning that segregation/dino-racism is bad.

Of the 12 direct-to-video sequels, none of the rest included Don Bluth, George Lucas or Steven Spielberg’s involvement. It’s hard to believe Lucas wasn’t involved in the sequelitis, but perhaps he rightfully recognized LAND BEFORE TIME as his crowning achievement, and didn’t want to fuck it up further like he did with Indy or STAR WARS.

THE LAND BEFORE TIME is nightmarish, forcing kids to come to grip with the possibility of life without their parents at a frightfully young age, but it has a powerful message: that with friends, you can accomplish anything, and beat the Sharptooth’s of the world. You’ll also learn to blame yourself for personal tragedy, but at least this time, Littlefoot has a point. It’s totally his fault his Mom died. Don’t wake up a T-Rex.

You’ll be bawling like Ducky and Spike:

I mean, COME ON:

Wanna cry more? Judith Barsi, who provides the adorable voice to Ducky, died when she was ten years old.

….Ready to drink? I thought so. Without further ado, I present…

THE LAND BEFORE TIME DRINKING GAME RULES:

1. Every time Cera’s a bitch, drink.

2. Drink every time Ducky makes an annoying/endearing noise. Yep yep yep.

3. I spy, with my little eye, a dinosaur egg. Your reward? Sip dat drank.

4. Drink every time the gang is in danger.

5. And while you’re at it, drink for every different type of dinosaur.

6. Have a sip for every flashback.

7. Drink when a character says something racist (“You can’t play with longnecks”). I don’t recommend screaming “Longneck bitch!” out loud during the proceedings. You’ll be sleeping on the couch.

8. Any time Petrie is afraid, drink. Double it if you are, because this shit is terrifying.

9. Yay, a TREE STAR! Quaff your beer. Be honest, you still get a tingly when you think about the magic of tree stars.

10. Drink when parents are openly concerned about their children.

11. Drink away your sorrows whenever you cry. It’ll happen.

And that’s it. But don’t cry. The beauty of THE LAND BEFORE TIME is that there are 12 MORE SEQUELS TO ENJOY. I can’t wait for THE LAND BEFORE TIME XIII: THE WISDOM OF FRIENDS. It sounds particularly inspiring and wise. With any luck, the franchise will continue, promising an infinite number of drinking games to enjoy.

THE “GET EXTINCT” EDITION: Just soldier on to the Great Valley and drink your way through more than one sequel in a night. Be sure to have a lot of Tree Star’s on the side. 

Most of us have heard of DUNE, if not read Frank Herbert’s philosophical masterpiece. Whether we’ve seen David Lynch’s nutty film, we’re at least aware that Sting and Patrick Stewart both starred in the disaster, and that spice (a hallucinogenic drug) plays an enormous role in the plot.

You might not know that 8 years before David Lynch’s DUNE came out, in the mid-1970’s, that an entirely different version was OH SO CLOSE to being made, from the Chilean psychedelic cult director Alejandro Jodorowsky, who practically created the midnight movie with EL TOPO and HOLY MOUNTAIN. This version was set to star Salvador Dali as the Emperor of the Galaxy. Orson Welles as the uber-fat, uber-villainous Baron Harkonnen. David Carradine as one of the leads. Mick Jagger had even signed on, and Pink Floyd was going to do the music for the world of Arrakis. The world and visuals came from H.R. Giger, Chris Foss and Dan O’Bannon. These “spiritual warriors,” as Jodorowsky calls them, would help shape the very future of science fiction with ALIEN. Despite never being made, Jodorowsky’s DUNE was everything.

Now, director Frank Pavich has crafted a masterful documentary (my gushing review can be found here), appropriately entitled JODOROWSKY’S DUNE, chronicling the wacky story of this almost-classic that never was, to enlighten the masses of one of the most fascinating “lost” films ever almost made. The movie comes out next Friday March 21st, to LA and New York before expanding across the country.

I recently had the chance to talk to Frank Pavich about his documentary and how Jodorowsky’s DUNE was a touchstone of science fiction, despite it never happening. In the following interview, we talk STAR WARS, BLADE RUNNER and play a game of what-if’s within the Hollywood landscape, discuss LSD, Hawaiian vacations, Mick Jagger, David Lynch, and everything in between.  Read on.

GREENE: How’s everything going with the film so far? What’s the next step with it?

PAVICH: So far, so good. We’re going to be in theatres March 21^st, so it’s really just trying to raise awareness of what’s coming out.

GREENE: It deserves a large audience, especially for the sci-fans out there, and if you can connect to that Comic-Con audience…

PAVICH: Exactly.

GREENE: Are you getting a limited release or a wide release?

PAVICH: It slowly grows. Starts limited, starts in New York and LA on the 21^st and then every week from there it spreads out through different cities. It basically goes as far as Honolulu, oddly enough. It really kind of hits the whole country.

GREENE: Well perfect. Hopefully there are a lot of DUNE fans in Hawaii.

PAVICH: I hope so, I hope so. That’d be good, right? I think I need to go to Hawaii to promote the film. Don’t you think that’d be necessary?

GREENE: I think so too, they need to comp you a trip there.

PAVICH: If you wouldn’t mind e-mailing or calling Sony and telling them that you think that, I’d really appreciate that. I could go for a nice tan. [Ed. Note: Sony hasn’t been answering my calls.]

GREENE: If I could come with, maybe I’ll do it.

PAVICH: I don’t see why not. If they’re going to buy one ticket, might as well buy a second one.

GREENE: The airlines might have a deal.

PAVICH: Yeah!

GREENE: How much did you know about Frank Herbert’s DUNE and Alejandro Jodorowsky’s DUNE film before picking this as your next project?

PAVICH: I came to the story from the Jodorowsky side. I came in as a big fan of his and knowing his films. So that was my introduction to this. When I first heard about this story, and I was like, “Oh, Alejandro Jodorowsky had a lost movie?” And not only that, but a lost movie that he basically completely realized; it wasn’t just a screenplay draft. He had a whole team working, and they were working for two years, and it was fully cast, and they had all these people attached. It was ready to go, every scene was drawn out on paper, the entire film from the first scene to the last scene. That’s what kind of first drew me to it, along with this amazing array of characters that he had involved. So really I don’t come from the DUNE side of things, I kind of approached it like he did, to a certain extent. I actually didn’t read the novel until I was on the plane, flying from New York to Paris to do our first interview with him. I feel like part of me didn’t want to jinx it. I wanted to follow his path. “I will make DUNE without having read it.” So I will make the DUNE documentary without having read it at that stage of the game. So my knowledge of DUNE all came as we were making the film, as we were doing our interviews. Which is kind of a great way to just immerse yourself into it.

GREENE: I think you did it right, I love it. That was one of my favorite parts in the film, when Jodorowsky wanted it to be his next project, yet he didn’t really know why, and hadn’t read the book.

PAVICH: Yeah, exactly. Something told him to make it that. That was it.

GREENE: So did you make it past the first 100 pages and beyond? It almost seemed like that was as far as Jodorowsky got.

PAVICH: Oh no, he’s read the whole thing. If you look at his screenplay, if you look at his book, it’s DUNE. There are certainly Jodorowsky flourishes in it, but it is almost an exact adaptation of the book. He’s just saying that it’s such a dense book, that in the first 100 pages, you don’t need any introductions to it, it’s complete. He considers it to be not just a pulpy, science fiction book, but he considers it to be great literature. He equates it to Proust and the classics. He knows it very well, for sure.

GREENE: Did you get a peek at Jodorowsky’s bible?

PAVICH: Of course. We shot it at his house and we animated directly from it. I know it quite well.

GREENE: I would’ve wanted to just take that thing. It’s like a rarified piece of treasure, it was awesome.

PAVICH: Oh yeah. There are only 2 left that are for sure in existence. He has one, and [Producer] Michel Seydoux has one. They think they made 20 when they came to the studios. Where those other 18 or so copies are is quite a mystery. It’d be great that when this movie comes out, people might come out of the woodwork. “I found this in my Uncle’s attic!” or “I found it in a box in the basement” or “It’s been on this shelf collecting dust for the past 40 years.” I figure those books must be somewhere. I’d be shocked if anyone would take a book of that size and throw it in the garbage. It’d be weird. Even if they don’t make the film, it’s like, “Wow, this is really cool to have.” If someone pitched it to me, I would keep it. It’s such an awesome thing to put on your shelf. It’s amazing.

GREENE: I think you have your sequel idea. The search for the missing bibles!

PAVICH: [laughs] The Hunt For The 18!

GREENE: I think I know the answer to this, but I’m going to ask anyways. Jodorowsky (above) is a goldmine of anecdotes and one-liners during the interviews. Is he any different off-camera or is he as wacky and wonderful as he seems?

PAVICH: Oh, it’s him. He’s completely genuine. He’s a performer, he’s a storyteller, but he’s not false. He gives you everything. There’s a video online [here], that I don’t know if you’ve seen, he entered his new film [LA DANZA DE REALIDAD] into a festival, in Montreal, and he could not make it to introduce the film, so he recorded a video that was played in the theatre before his film showed. It’s him completely nude sitting in a chair, talking to the camera, and explaining his film. He’s basically saying that in his new film, he exposed himself completely, spiritually, and mentally, for the audience. So now in his introduction, he’s completed it, and he is exposing himself physically, as well. He goes all out. No matter what he does, he goes all out. He’s incredible.

GREENE: I love that. It’s so admirable. It’s scary to Hollywood, unfortunately. Or it was. Though I think it still would be.

PAVICH: I think so. Although it’s weird. If you think about Hollywood…Hollywood was scared of Jodorowsky, because they were scared of losing money. That’s really all they care about. Is the money. They want a lot. They were scared to lose money. And he was ahead of his time. He came up with this idea of making this giant megabucks space opera before anybody, before STAR WARS and all that stuff. If you look at the timeline, here comes this really out there avant-garde director with this giant budgeted space opera and pitch it to the studios. They have no idea what to make of it. They have no idea. [As the studios] “The films you’ve made, EL TOPO and HOLY MOUNTAIN, don’t lend themselves to material like this,” and they don’t get the material, so they say no. Then a year or two later, STAR WARS is released, which is a film that 20^th Century FOX was not high on anyway. They thought it was dumb, they thought it wasn’t going to make any money. They were barely support of it. Little did they know, little did anyone know, what a huge blockbuster that would be, basically starting the blockbuster movement more or less. Then suddenly every studio wanted to make science fiction. There were sequels, they were bringing back STAR TREK onto the big screen, they were doing everything they could, anything in space, green lighting, “Go! Go! Go! Make money!” Then a couple years later, they decide to go back to the DUNE project, and who do they get but essentially a director very similar and very much in the vein of Jodorowsky himself. They didn’t get Spielberg to direct it, they didn’t get the Michael Bay of that time, whomever that might be, they got somebody very similar to Jodorowsky [one David Lynch]. In ’76, they thought it was stupid and “Oh, how could someone who made EL TOPO and HOLY MOUNTAIN make something like this?” But then in ’84, they get the guy who made ELEPHANT MAN and ERASERHEAD, to direct the biggest movie of its time. It cost $60 million. It was the biggest budgeted film yet. So suddenly they thought, oh we’re going to make money with this, they started preparing Paul Atreides action figures, and TOPPS trading cards, and coloring books, for children? This is not a kid’s movie. This is not a story for children, by any stretch. I don’t know who in the studio had read the script, had read the book, had been on set, had seen David Lynch’s films, but this is not aimed at kids. It’s a really weird thing that they tried to do. I don’t know who was not paying attention or what was going on over there. But it’s strange, because the studios came around and oh yes, we’ll do it now. It’s really bizarre. Really bizarre.

GREENE: The whole thing is bizarre. There’s even an element to it all that makes you angry. The movie is engrossing, entertaining, but it also drove me to fury. I kept flashing back to the scene in CREATURE FROM THE BLACK LAGOON, when the archaeologists find a fossilized Creature claw and handle it like it’s any other rock you might find on the beach. You just shiver. The whole thing makes you feel a little dirty.

PAVICH: That’s interesting. That’s really interesting. Yeah, wow.

GREENE: Because of Hollywood’s treatment of Jodorowsky’s project. You mentioned you hoped Hollywood execs wouldn’t have thrown the bibles in the trash, but they kind of threw away this beautiful project away. Was this rage or frustration part of why you took on the film or was it a conscience effort in making it?

PAVICH: Before we started working, I was just more fascinated by it. How did such a thing happen? How did it get so far along? And it’s just so incredible. But the anger or frustration or whatever it is quickly dissipates, because when you spend time with Jodorowsky, you start to see how he feels about it. He feels that it worked out wonderfully. He has no regrets. He says he doesn’t feel that it’s a failure. He says it’s a great success. He did his version of DUNE, and here it is in the book and everything is completely realized, ready to go, and it’s wonderful. He wanted to change the world with his film as he said, he wanted to change history, and he basically did. His spiritual warriors went out into the world and took those ideas with them, and other ideas of his just somehow ended up in other films. He feels vindicated. He sees exactly what happened. Yes, I was right. My spiritual warriors, my team, were the best people. Their careers were made better. [As Jodorowsky] “My career went wonderfully, and I used my ideas, and put them in books, and put them in other films.” He has zero animosity toward any of it. Once you spend time with him, and you get that sense, you kind of agree with him. Why does it have to be negative? You don’t have spend your years crouched over, you can open yourself up to everything. As he said, “Yes we did not make DUNE. Yes, we did not make DUNE.” It’s beautiful. He has a beautiful outlook on everything.

GREENE: It’s inspirational. What others would qualify as a failure he doesn’t, and his spiritual warriors, like H.R. Giger, Chris Foss, Dan O’Bannon, they blew up.

PAVICH: Yeah, those people had never done movies before. That’s what so interesting. He wasn’t picking people based on movies; he was picking people based on their pure art. Giger had never done movies. Chris Foss had never done movies. Moebius had never done movies. They all went off to go make movies, and work in films, but he saw something special and unique in them. And he sought them out. They weren’t looking to get into the movie business, but he just saw their art, and was like “Oh, I want to work with this person.” They have incredible vision and we get to be together in this endeavor.

GREENE: It’s rare, because most directors that are making passion projects, they’re almost the opposite of Jodorowsky. They want what they want, and that’s that. Whereas Jodorowsky wants them to just play, go with what it is in their hearts and it’ll all work out, essentially.

PAVICH: He’s not trying to crush anybody, he’s trying to inspire them. To do great art. Chris Foss says that his only regret working on DUNE was that he didn’t realize what he had. He didn’t realize that working on a movie could be that free and that beautiful and that wonderful. Because the movies he did afterwards, he said were not like that. Working on ALIEN was very difficult. Working with Steven Spielberg on AI he found very difficult. He didn’t have that freedom that Jodorowsky provided.

GREENE: I know that it’s not really the point, and that you and he think he succeeded in his goal, and you’ve convinced me. But Jodorowsky actually says at the end of the film that he hopes someone takes his vision and makes his DUNE. I practically wanted to start a Kickstarter before I left the movie theatre.

PAVICH: [laughs]

GREENE: Do you think his vision of DUNE will ever come to life?

PAVICH: I don’t know if anybody will be able to make an animated version. I don’t know if a book of art would ever be able to be published. Who knows, that also comes down to the Frank Herbert estate, I would assume, because the underlying story is very obviously Frank Herbert’s. So, you’d have to get their permission and option it again, if they even wanted something like that. Time will tell, I guess we’ll see what happens with this documentary. If enough people get inspired, that could change the course of events.

GREENE: Speaking of changing the course of events, playing the “what-if” game is always fun with these projects. If Jodorowsky’s Dune had been made exactly how he wanted it, what do you think the impact of the film would’ve been? Would it have been STAR WARS before STAR WARS?

PAVICH: It’s interesting. If you look at the concept of a multiverse, there’s all the different parallel timelines you can look at. We know what happens when Jodorowsky got as far as he got and the film is not complete, and not made into an actual feature film. We know how this universe looks, and this timeline looks. But let’s say that he had successfully completed the film, and it was a success. Let’s say it’s the biggest success in the world and everybody was lining up around the block to see it and it was incredible. I wonder where movies would be now, because that would tell the executives, the financiers, the studios, that these kinds of bizarre, avant-garde Jodorowsky-ian, David Lynch-ian films are worthwhile. And maybe we would see more pure artistic visions, as opposed to moneymaking schemes, reboots, franchises, the kinds of stuff we get now. Maybe we would see more independent voices being allowed to really speak their minds. On the flip side, let’s say Jodorowsky’s vision of DUNE had been completed, and it was a disaster. Let’s say it was the biggest flop in the history of mankind. Only seven tickets were sold and it collapsed an entire studio. And it was the worst thing ever, nobody believed in it. Then where would we be? Because already at that point, George Lucas was working on STAR WARS, and he was at 20^th Century Fox, and 20^th Century Fox did not believe in STAR WARS. They thought it was a silly idea, “Who would want to see a space movie? This is ridiculous.” And of course we know what happened, STAR WARS came out and it was this mega-blockbuster and perhaps started this whole science fiction renaissance almost. Everybody was making science fiction movies. How many billions of dollars have the STAR WARS movies made? But if Jodorowsky’s DUNE had been a flop and seeing as FOX hadn’t believed in STAR WARS, they probably would’ve used that as their first excuse to pull the plug on STAR WARS. There wouldn’t be STAR WARS, there wouldn’t be the film landscape that we’re in now, for better or for worse. If that was the case, what would the big tentpole movies be every summer? They wouldn’t be STAR WARS type movies, probably wouldn’t be the AVENGERS or superhero films, it might be something completely different. Maybe it’d be Merchant Ivory films. Maybe everybody would be lining up to see period romances. Who knows? We’d be living in a different landscape, so it’s really interesting to imagine those.

GREENE: Oh yeah. You could just go for hours debating the possibilities or charting it like it’s TRUE DETECTIVE or something.

PAVICH: Yeah, exactly. And looking at the movies that DUNE is directly responsible for, obviously it brought the people together who made ALIEN. Which, in itself, transforms film history. If you look at the ALIEN sequels, that’s where James Cameron got his start. That’s where David Fincher got his start. All these voices got their starts in those films. If you look at Ridley Scott’s BLADE RUNNER, that changed science fiction history in another way. BLADE RUNNER never would’ve happened without Jodorowsky’s DUNE. Because Dan O’Bannon and Moebius met on DUNE and together they wrote a comic book called THE LONG TOMORROW. THE LONG TOMORROW is exactly the world of BLADE RUNNER. If you look at the designs in the book, it’s exactly what Sydney [Syd Mead, “visual futurist”] and Ridley Scott put up on the screens for BLADE RUNNER. There are so many things where the lines of history go back to this project. It’s astounding.

GREENE: Clearly, Jodorowsky was this seed of sci-fi, and it was going to spring forth, whether he made the movie or not.

PAVICH: Right.

GREENE: It’s great that this documentary exists because of that. I was with you, I hadn’t read Frank Herbert’s DUNE when I walked into the documentary. While I was well aware of DUNE, and had seen Lynch’s version, I had no idea about this lost film, and I think many people are in the same boat. That’s what makes this film and all its “what-if” scenarios and bringing to light all of its influences, so necessary. Especially for sci-fi fans.

PAVICH: I think so.

GREENE: Alright, now I have two very serious questions for you.

PAVICH: Excellent. Bring it on.

GREENE: Did you do LSD with Alejandro Jodorowsky?

PAVICH: You know, he lives a completely dry life. He doesn’t drink alcohol, he doesn’t do anything like that. He claims that he’s only done LSD one time in his life, that he paid $17,000 to a shaman in New York City to dye him on his trip. I don’t know if that’s true or not, but that’s what he claims. Actually I saw him last night, he’s in New York, and we spent a little time together. We sat in his hotel room and drank pineapple juice. That’s how he lives so long. If he was a drug-fueled madman, I don’t think he’d be with us today. He lives a very clean, very pure life. It’s very interesting.

GREENE: It’s not what you’d expect. But it’s another one of those things to admire about him. He can be so bizarre without having to rely on drugs.

PAVICH: Exactly. He is what he is. He has these spiritual visions with his projects, and that somehow just comes naturally to him. It’s amazing. But good question, I haven’t been asked that one before. Fantastic.

GREENE: Speaking of drug-fueled madmen, did you approach Mick Jagger to talk about the film?

PAVICH: You know, we didn’t, because he was such a minor player in this whole story, that it would’ve felt too much like stunt casting. If Mick Jagger was going to play the lead role in the film, that would’ve been different. If David Carradine was still alive, then we definitely would’ve approached him, or had him involved, or Orson Welles, or Salvador Dali. But I think Mick Jagger was such a minor thing, that it just would’ve felt false. I never appreciate documentaries that had that kind of stunt casting. “What is this famous person doing here that really has no connection to anything?” I went for a limited number of voices, which let’s you get to know each one of them on a deeper level.

GREENE: I totally agree, I was just curious.

PAVICH: Of course.

GREENE: We’ve kind of touched on it previously, but seeing Moebius, Chris Foss and H.R. Giger’s artwork come to life on film were some of my favorite parts. It’s just so beautiful. I got the sense that you could fill another 90 minutes of all the concept art produced by these guys.

PAVICH: If we had filmed Jodorowsky’s entire bible, the movie would’ve gone for over 20 hours like Jodorowsky wanted!

GREENE & PAVICH: [laughs]

GREENE: I think that covers most of it. I’ll make us both sound more intelligent, mostly me.

PAVICH: Excellent. [laughter]

To confess that it’s rocked a few friendships maybe isn’t that shocking, but I am still not ashamed to admit that I have never seen STAR WARS, nor do I have any direct intention to. Not to say that if it’s on or some buddies want to watch it I’ll run for the hills screaming, but I won’t put it on of my own accord. Why? Because I don’t need to. And I am no less of a nerd for having not watched it.

Everyone loves STAR WARS. And what do people do when they love something? They talk about it. Constantly. (LOST, anyone? I never even finished Season 1 because the entire series was spoiled for me by the daily chatter and buzz about it.) I already know the plot twists (Thanks, PITCH PERFECT! But not really.) and have a general idea of what each installation is about, so why do I need to waste an entire day watching it? I like to maintain a spoiler-free zone at all times.

“But, hey! What about all it did for science fiction and film in general! You can’t deny it was revolutionary!”

I never said it wasn’t. I can appreciate how something was revolutionary and changed cinema without liking it (CITIZEN KANE? Who actually likes that movie?) or even watching it. I can respect STAR WARS and George Lucas all the same and still avoid sitting through R2D2 and Yoda for hours on end.

The big question I keep getting slammed with is: Why do I feel that STAR WARS should not be the golden standard to which we hold nerds and nerd-pride? Well, to me it seems to be the opposite. Why is STAR WARS the big kahuna? Why is STAR WARS the be-all-end-all? Without having seen it, I can only infer from the spoilers I’ve been privy to, that it was a largely generic story, albeit with a couple good twists and turns and a sci-fi journey that maybe hadn’t been seen before. But was it actually good? CITIZEN KANE –while it makes me want to gauge my eyes out – was a good movie. It was well-made, beautifully written, superbly acted… it just wasn’t my thing.

From all I’ve heard about STAR WARS, all the OMG STAR WARS, WTF U HAVEN’T SEEN IT and DISNEY’S GOING TO RUIN IT, I haven’t been told a single reason as to why everyone loves it so much. Colorful weapons, philosophical aliens, shiny robots, cool. I can get that pretty much anywhere, so why STAR WARS? Was it well-made, beautifully written, or superbly acted? In all the things I’ve heard and read about STAR WARS, I have never been witness to anyone commenting on the quality of the components individually, only the film as a whole. (Which, to be fair, was still mostly ERMAHGERD LERT SERBERS or drooling over the drones or whatever. I won’t pretend to know what they’re called.) Are being “revolutionary” and “good” mutually inclusive? From where I sit on my tiny soap box that’s covered in rotten tomatoes, no. They aren’t.

“Well, then you aren’t a real nerd!”

Ergo, my nerd-cred is then slammed for my aversion to STAR WARS every time it comes up, but I am still a nerd. (Sorry, folks!) I absolutely considered getting a GAME OF THRONES tattoo (I already have one for DOCTOR WHO!) and I am proud to say that I probably have more X-MEN comics than you.

But, if it’s so important to judge nerd (or is it fanboy? A topic for another time) culture and popularity, why shouldn’t it be on something absurdly impressive and noteworthy? Let’s take a vote on how many of us have seen all the original episodes of DOCTOR WHO: the longest running science fiction show in the history of television. At final count I believe it was 784 Classic episodes. And that’ not including any mini-movies, radio episodes, or any other DW narratives that used to air. I’m only halfway through season 1, but that’s probably a whole lot further than the rest of you self-proclaimed nerds.

Time permitting I’ll eventually finish up BATTLESTAR GALACTICA and all the STAR TREK series’. I own all the extended editions of LORD OF THE RINGS – am slightly embarrassed at how many times I’ve watched them – and the complete ADVENTURES OF SHERLOCK HOLMES (in hardback leather binding, no less). I have no words to express how I feel about X-MEN: THE LAST STAND and am more hesitant than I’d like to admit about upcoming CAPTAIN AMERICA: THE WINTER SOLDIER. I refuse to borrow any books even if it’s only to read them once; I MUST OWN THEM. And I faithfully watch BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER all the way through seasons 1-7, once a year every year.

But my nerd-cred, no matter how big or how small, is thoroughly dismissed by all the “real nerds” because I choose to remain a STAR WARS virgin. I vote we abolish all the nerd-shaming and competition over who has bigger glasses and higher wasted jeans. In the hippie spirit of my motherland, Berkeley, California: Stop the nerdism. Love the nerds.

#NerdLove

NOTE: The images were chosen by your faithful editor, who happens to like CITIZEN KANE.